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Post by ComfortZone on Jun 9, 2022 9:00:21 GMT 12
I see the electric tug has arrived electrek.co/2022/06/08/meet-sparky-the-electric-tugboat-operating-in-the-ports-of-auckland-with-2784-kwh-of-power/#disqus_threadseems to have slipped in under the radar while POAL back pedal on cancelling their messed up automation programme. This tug is misleadingly referred to as "all-electric". It is equipped with 2 x 1,000kW Cat diesel generators which would have been used for its delivery and I am quite sure when the batteries are getting down a bit will be used to provide a bit more push. I have read elsewhere, but unconfirmed, that the first ship she assisted docking was one delivering Indonesian coal Huntly bound - rather ironic if true |
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Post by em on Jun 9, 2022 9:57:26 GMT 12
I didn’t read the original hyperbole but isn’t the primary reason for the tugs commissioning to save on fuel ? It’s not a lot different to a diesel/electric loco apart that it runs solely on electric for periods of time . If it saves them money long term then good on them
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Post by fish on Jun 9, 2022 11:41:25 GMT 12
This electric tug, and the new electric ferries have lower whole of life costs. i.e. it saves the owner money. That is the primary decision point. It is why I purchased firstly a little hybrid commuter (Honda Insight) then the PHEV family car.
There is an added bonus with these cars that I can use them to wind up GO30, and for POAL to get good spin and PR, but the bottom line is entirely financial.
Yes there is a financial risk for how long the batteries will last, but currently there is a massive risk in the operating cost of diesel powered vessels...
PS, laughed my arse off, First boat it help berth was importing indo coal?!?!?!
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Post by em on Jun 9, 2022 12:06:34 GMT 12
This electric tug, and the new electric ferries have lower whole of life costs. i.e. it saves the owner money. That is the primary decision point. It is why I purchased firstly a little hybrid commuter (Honda Insight) then the PHEV family car. There is an added bonus with these cars that I can use them to wind up GO30, and for POAL to get good spin and PR, but the bottom line is entirely financial. Yes there is a financial risk for how long the batteries will last, but currently there is a massive risk in the operating cost of diesel powered vessels... PS, laughed my arse off, First boat it help berth was importing indo coal?!?!?! Same here with our PHEV outlander , saves heaps on fuel . It’s a 1st generation model , done almost 190k , 9 years old , never gets plugged in because we are offgrid , haven’t had any issues with it . It’s very boringly the best car we have owned |
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Post by ComfortZone on Jun 9, 2022 13:10:42 GMT 12
I didn’t read the original hyperbole but isn’t the primary reason for the tugs commissioning to save on fuel ? It’s not a lot different to a diesel/electric loco apart that it runs solely on electric for periods of time . If it saves them money long term then good on them you would hope that a discounted cashflow analysis, amongst other checks, was undertaken to confirm the economic viability of the electric tug. Capex is reported to be double that of a straight diesel, OPEX when considering energy costs should be lower, but the big question is the sustaining capital consideration for battery(2240 of them) replacement. I know a POAL board member, must remember to ask the question and see if I can get any info divulged. This is the first full size tug of its kind, hope it does not turn into another bleeding edge project like their container handling automation fiasco As an aside the "charging station" must be pretty impressive ie a major substation, as they are talking a charge rate of ~1.5MW/hr, can't find the specs for her to verify the battery voltage, will be some hefty cables for charging |
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Post by fish on Jun 9, 2022 13:31:16 GMT 12
They have a permanent crane boom thingee with all the charging cables mounted in racks on it.
It is certainly not the old 10 amp extension cord dropped over the side of the wharf, looped around a stanchion and run into the cockpit locker set up.
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Post by El Toro on Jun 9, 2022 14:06:49 GMT 12
History repeating itself, the worlds first 21st century coal powered tug boat.....fucking genuis
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Post by sloopjohnb on Jun 9, 2022 14:55:05 GMT 12
Talk about POAL saving money, In the Dom this morning they are scraping the $65m automation system which has been going few a few years now.
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Post by Fogg on Jun 9, 2022 15:36:42 GMT 12
If the E-tech now means that people are buying cleaner kit (cars, boats etc) primarily for financial reasons, isn’t that a win-win, rather than something to criticise?
After all, the critics always said cleaner energy solutions must be affordable to be attractive and if that’s now happening then surely it’s good news?
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Post by em on Jun 9, 2022 15:59:30 GMT 12
History repeating itself, the worlds first 21st century coal powered tug boat.....fucking genuis Not as genius as funding a melges 40 programme with the profits of EV sales ! |
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Post by ComfortZone on Jun 9, 2022 19:30:32 GMT 12
They have a permanent crane boom thingee with all the charging cables mounted in racks on it. It is certainly not the old 10 amp extension cord dropped over the side of the wharf, looped around a stanchion and run into the cockpit locker set up. Wonder if they have an EWOF   |
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Post by GO30 on Jun 11, 2022 12:05:20 GMT 12
The electric tug cost the PoA a LOT more than a a standard one does. Also as is standard practice and a necessity for things around EV, we'll ignore the huge costs and all the extra dirty created while developing it, building it, putting in all the support gear and of course what to do with the very toxic outputs they will continue to vomit using current technology.
The much vaulted electric ferry in Welly cost frecking moonbeams and is already on it's second set of batteries. No idea what's happening to the 2 plus tonnes of toxic they now need to get rid of. What's the beat that will just get quietly slid into the local landfill?
The lectrics for AT, cha ching....... and again with huge infrastructure costs. Plus some sneaky being built in which is purely for political reasons.
All 3 of those projects reckon the technologies being used will be out of date in 5 years time. They will still work but be effectively obsolete. At this stage most of these projects don't stack up in cleanliness, efficiency or value for money, but one day they might. The more people talk up the sub standard that is the current state of play, the lower they will make the eventual standard. But then a lot of this is more to do with insta and political photo ops than it is about being nice to the planet.
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Post by Fogg on Jun 11, 2022 19:41:04 GMT 12
I don’t really care what’s happened to the Wgtn ferry’s previous batteries - I’m more focused on the bigger picture.
If the purchase of the Wgtn ferry and POAL tug sends signals to potential innovators & investors that there is a real market waiting to buy the tech - even in it’s very early ‘bleeding edge’ stages - then thats a huge shift and will help accelerate progress even further.
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Post by dutyfree on Jun 12, 2022 13:34:22 GMT 12
Not sure as a rate and tax payer I want my dime spent on bleeding edge.
Private investors, knock yourself out.
Overseas I see China and Europe deploying some electric tugs. Fast follower for a small, isolated, increasingly poor country looks like a much better place. There is no first mover advantage to us of doing this.
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Post by Fogg on Jun 12, 2022 17:59:39 GMT 12
From what you’re saying it sounds like NZ is being a fast-follower not first-mover (other countries already doing similar)?
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