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Starlink
Jul 30, 2024 7:52:01 GMT 12
via mobile
Post by dutyfree on Jul 30, 2024 7:52:01 GMT 12
What are they going to do when the satellite tech get miniaturized to a cellphone
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Post by muzled on Jul 30, 2024 9:21:01 GMT 12
What are they going to do when the satellite tech get miniaturized to a cellphone meh, that'll be a problem for a different corrupt king by the time it happens...
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Post by em on Jul 30, 2024 9:44:14 GMT 12
What are they going to do when the satellite tech get miniaturized to a cellphone meh, that'll be a problem for a different corrupt king by the time it happens... Due to happen fairly soon in NZ . Text only sometime this year and then calls , data will apparently roll out next year . You will only need your phone as a hotspot to get internet anywhere within the 12 Mile limit . Coverage will be provided by spaceX satellites , hopefully you won’t have to pay for it with Xcoins !
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Post by muzled on Jul 30, 2024 10:31:48 GMT 12
meh, that'll be a problem for a different corrupt king by the time it happens... Due to happen fairly soon in NZ . Text only sometime this year and then calls , data will apparently roll out next year . You will only need your phone as a hotspot to get internet anywhere within the 12 Mile limit . Coverage will be provided by spaceX satellites , hopefully you won’t have to pay for it with Xcoins ! Cheers em, I didn't know that. So once the data part happens you'll likely need to go onto an 'anywhere' plan, but you won't need starlink to watch tik tok while in the back blocks of Fiordland?
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Post by GO30 on Jul 30, 2024 12:21:20 GMT 12
Why add another layer of potential issues by involving Vodaone whom whoever it is, just go direct to Elon and use one of the plethora of interweb phone thingy gizmos.
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Post by BatteryGuy on Jul 31, 2024 10:48:47 GMT 12
Why add another layer of potential issues by involving Vodaone whom whoever it is, just go direct to Elon and use one of the plethora of interweb phone thingy gizmos. At the moment you can't. The local providers like OneNZ have the spectrum rights which will work with a miniature receiver like that found in a handset. When team musk figures out how to miniturize the starlink receivers into a handset sized unit then that will be a game changer and your "phone" will be internet only. But that's a good few years away and even the best minds are saying that when they nail it it will be limited by physics to a maximum speed of ~15mbit/s something about the pesky speed of light. So if you want faster, then you need a phase array antenna which will never fit in a phone sized device.
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Post by fish on Jul 31, 2024 11:00:44 GMT 12
Why add another layer of potential issues by involving Vodaone whom whoever it is, just go direct to Elon and use one of the plethora of interweb phone thingy gizmos. At the moment you can't. The local providers like OneNZ have the spectrum rights which will work with a miniature receiver like that found in a handset. When team musk figures out how to miniturize the starlink receivers into a handset sized unit then that will be a game changer and your "phone" will be internet only. But that's a good few years away and even the best minds are saying that when they nail it it will be limited by physics to a maximum speed of ~15mbit/s something about the pesky speed of light. So if you want faster, then you need a phase array antenna which will never fit in a phone sized device. I love watching people try to fight the laws of physics. You can tell them they are trying to break a law, and they be like 'don't give no fuck about laws' Uh ha, but this one is a law of physics ;-)
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Post by GO30 on Jul 31, 2024 13:15:43 GMT 12
Why add another layer of potential issues by involving Vodaone whom whoever it is, just go direct to Elon and use one of the plethora of interweb phone thingy gizmos. At the moment you can't. The local providers like OneNZ have the spectrum rights which will work with a miniature receiver like that found in a handset. When team musk figures out how to miniturize the starlink receivers into a handset sized unit then that will be a game changer and your "phone" will be internet only. But that's a good few years away and even the best minds are saying that when they nail it it will be limited by physics to a maximum speed of ~15mbit/s something about the pesky speed of light. So if you want faster, then you need a phase array antenna which will never fit in a phone sized device. In rural we are right on the very edge of cell reception and at very best we may see 3G occasionally. If the wind blows the wrong way we get shite if anything. Yes I know it's not the wind but whatever it is that caused the reception wobbles it is that fickle. Usually we get just H and some times H+, 4G is a dream and 5G is nothing but a conspiracy theory. Interweb is hot spot only or pulled down from the sky. We want to add some monitoring and things so we need interweb. We've been told to wait for OneNZ but why when what they will offer is already available. We add Starlink to the roof and boom, fast Interweb and reliable phone service via one of the many apps, Whatsapp being a well known one of those. I can't see anything One is offering that's worth the wait.
Neighbours with assorted 'rural' options find most patchy as they are also based on cell towers. The direct neighbours ladys collection, the farm has a few households on it, are ecstatic as they can now interweb shop themselves stupid due to vastly improved web. The oung fella got pissed with some cellbased interweb system for farms so rang Elon,they are now Starlink and loving it....except maybe Ian who reckons his Wa of many decades just got extra bloody expensive
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Punter / Battery Guy
Guest
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Starlink
Jul 31, 2024 23:10:01 GMT 12
via mobile
Post by Punter / Battery Guy on Jul 31, 2024 23:10:01 GMT 12
At the moment you can't. The local providers like OneNZ have the spectrum rights which will work with a miniature receiver like that found in a handset. When team musk figures out how to miniturize the starlink receivers into a handset sized unit then that will be a game changer and your "phone" will be internet only. But that's a good few years away and even the best minds are saying that when they nail it it will be limited by physics to a maximum speed of ~15mbit/s something about the pesky speed of light. So if you want faster, then you need a phase array antenna which will never fit in a phone sized device. In rural we are right on the very edge of cell reception and at very best we may see 3G occasionally. If the wind blows the wrong way we get shite if anything. Yes I know it's not the wind but whatever it is that caused the reception wobbles it is that fickle. Usually we get just H and some times H+, 4G is a dream and 5G is nothing but a conspiracy theory. Interweb is hot spot only or pulled down from the sky. We want to add some monitoring and things so we need interweb. We've been told to wait for OneNZ but why when what they will offer is already available. We add Starlink to the roof and boom, fast Interweb and reliable phone service via one of the many apps, Whatsapp being a well known one of those. I can't see anything One is offering that's worth the wait.
Neighbours with assorted 'rural' options find most patchy as they are also based on cell towers. The direct neighbours ladys collection, the farm has a few households on it, are ecstatic as they can now interweb shop themselves stupid due to vastly improved web. The oung fella got pissed with some cellbased interweb system for farms so rang Elon,they are now Starlink and loving it....except maybe Ian who reckons his Wa of many decades just got extra bloody expensive What OneNZ will offer is not already available. You're conflating two completely different technologies. OneNZ will be offering SpaceX to Mobile Phones. It will initially be TXT only, then they will add voice and eventually they will add data. According to the Rocket Scientists the data speed will never be able exceed around 15Mbit/s this is apparently due to the physical limitations at a wave length level of how much space a receiver needs to take up to. It's a universe limitation like the speed of light. Right now you can buy Starlink. Which uses big antennas the same SpaceX constellation but different frewuencies. The antennas are much bigger than your phone and can comfortably reach 100Mbits/s and faster. Whoever said wait for OneNZ to get mobile on your phone either is a idiot or didn't have all the information. If they meant wait for Chorus to deliver fibre and then get a service via OneNZ over the fibre then that's a very different proposition and is a order of magnitude better than Starlink. If the meant wait for OneNZ to plop in another cell tower then that is also a very different proposition and a few less orders better than fibre but still better than Starlink. If you have a modern mobile phone with VoWiFi it will work over any of the above services when you don't have 3G/4G. I was taking and making regular txt and voice calls in the middle of the south Pacific over starlink with zero issues just last week. And of course I also had full Internet access. Tldr; Get starlink. If local services become available in the future you can always switch and sell the starlink I can discuss with you next time I come to buy a rope.
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Post by em on Aug 1, 2024 7:49:06 GMT 12
In rural we are right on the very edge of cell reception and at very best we may see 3G occasionally. If the wind blows the wrong way we get shite if anything. Yes I know it's not the wind but whatever it is that caused the reception wobbles it is that fickle. Usually we get just H and some times H+, 4G is a dream and 5G is nothing but a conspiracy theory. Interweb is hot spot only or pulled down from the sky. We want to add some monitoring and things so we need interweb. We've been told to wait for OneNZ but why when what they will offer is already available. We add Starlink to the roof and boom, fast Interweb and reliable phone service via one of the many apps, Whatsapp being a well known one of those. I can't see anything One is offering that's worth the wait.
Neighbours with assorted 'rural' options find most patchy as they are also based on cell towers. The direct neighbours ladys collection, the farm has a few households on it, are ecstatic as they can now interweb shop themselves stupid due to vastly improved web. The oung fella got pissed with some cellbased interweb system for farms so rang Elon,they are now Starlink and loving it....except maybe Ian who reckons his Wa of many decades just got extra bloody expensive What OneNZ will offer is not already available. You're conflating two completely different technologies. OneNZ will be offering SpaceX to Mobile Phones. It will initially be TXT only, then they will add voice and eventually they will add data. According to the Rocket Scientists the data speed will never be able exceed around 15Mbit/s this is apparently due to the physical limitations at a wave length level of how much space a receiver needs to take up to. It's a universe limitation like the speed of light. Right now you can buy Starlink. Which uses big antennas the same SpaceX constellation but different frewuencies. The antennas are much bigger than your phone and can comfortably reach 100Mbits/s and faster. Whoever said wait for OneNZ to get mobile on your phone either is a idiot or didn't have all the information. If they meant wait for Chorus to deliver fibre and then get a service via OneNZ over the fibre then that's a very different proposition and is a order of magnitude better than Starlink. If the meant wait for OneNZ to plop in another cell tower then that is also a very different proposition and a few less orders better than fibre but still better than Starlink. If you have a modern mobile phone with VoWiFi it will work over any of the above services when you don't have 3G/4G. I was taking and making regular txt and voice calls in the middle of the south Pacific over starlink with zero issues just last week. And of course I also had full Internet access. Tldr; Get starlink. If local services become available in the future you can always switch and sell the starlink I can discuss with you next time I come to buy a rope. So you reckon 4G is quicker than what OneNz will offer via spaceX ? I have my phone on rocket mobile/one republic with unlimited data and it was excellent for cruising last summer . We could hotspot and watch Netflix , YouTube etc no problem on iPad and MacBook even with only two bars of signal at times . We see internet on the boat as a nice to have not a need so if OneNz is average probably won’t bother with it . On the other hand it would add one more level of safety being able to text or call from somewhere remote like Fiordland etc . Do you think it would improve the Predictwind race tracker ?!
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Post by fish on Aug 1, 2024 8:50:49 GMT 12
What OneNZ will offer is not already available. You're conflating two completely different technologies. OneNZ will be offering SpaceX to Mobile Phones. It will initially be TXT only, then they will add voice and eventually they will add data. According to the Rocket Scientists the data speed will never be able exceed around 15Mbit/s this is apparently due to the physical limitations at a wave length level of how much space a receiver needs to take up to. It's a universe limitation like the speed of light. Right now you can buy Starlink. Which uses big antennas the same SpaceX constellation but different frewuencies. The antennas are much bigger than your phone and can comfortably reach 100Mbits/s and faster. Whoever said wait for OneNZ to get mobile on your phone either is a idiot or didn't have all the information. If they meant wait for Chorus to deliver fibre and then get a service via OneNZ over the fibre then that's a very different proposition and is a order of magnitude better than Starlink. If the meant wait for OneNZ to plop in another cell tower then that is also a very different proposition and a few less orders better than fibre but still better than Starlink. If you have a modern mobile phone with VoWiFi it will work over any of the above services when you don't have 3G/4G. I was taking and making regular txt and voice calls in the middle of the south Pacific over starlink with zero issues just last week. And of course I also had full Internet access. Tldr; Get starlink. If local services become available in the future you can always switch and sell the starlink I can discuss with you next time I come to buy a rope. So you reckon 4G is quicker than what OneNz will offer via spaceX ? I have my phone on rocket mobile/one republic with unlimited data and it was excellent for cruising last summer . We could hotspot and watch Netflix , YouTube etc no problem on iPad and MacBook even with only two bars of signal at times . We see internet on the boat as a nice to have not a need so if OneNz is average probably won’t bother with it . On the other hand it would add one more level of safety being able to text or call from somewhere remote like Fiordland etc . Do you think it would improve the Predictwind race tracker ?! Aren't these two different issues em? Starlink is about getting internet where there is no mobile coverage, i.e. mid Pacific, darkest fiordland. Then there are the 'transition spots' from the mobile network, like rural Tai Tokerau, east coast of Barrier etc. The advantage of starlink in those situations is it is low latency, as in when compared to Irridium or what ever the other satellite services are. For Gulf / Northland coast cruising I would have thought cellular internet is loads better, not measured on speed so much as cost and ease. The only caveat being single dead spots. I'd say the big safety step up with Starlink is the ability to get current weather forecasts. The phone handheld starlink option will help with that with basic two way comms (texting), but I assume you will need someone to message you the forecast as opposed to downloading it direct from the web. Obviously the ability to two way text in darkest Fiordland will assist greatly with safety as well. Provided you can charge you phone somehow.
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Post by em on Aug 1, 2024 9:13:05 GMT 12
So you reckon 4G is quicker than what OneNz will offer via spaceX ? I have my phone on rocket mobile/one republic with unlimited data and it was excellent for cruising last summer . We could hotspot and watch Netflix , YouTube etc no problem on iPad and MacBook even with only two bars of signal at times . We see internet on the boat as a nice to have not a need so if OneNz is average probably won’t bother with it . On the other hand it would add one more level of safety being able to text or call from somewhere remote like Fiordland etc . Do you think it would improve the Predictwind race tracker ?! Aren't these two different issues em? Starlink is about getting internet where there is no mobile coverage, i.e. mid Pacific, darkest fiordland. Then there are the 'transition spots' from the mobile network, like rural Tai Tokerau, east coast of Barrier etc. The advantage of starlink in those situations is it is low latency, as in when compared to Irridium or what ever the other satellite services are. For Gulf / Northland coast cruising I would have thought cellular internet is loads better, not measured on speed so much as cost and ease. The only caveat being single dead spots. I'd say the big safety step up with Starlink is the ability to get current weather forecasts. The phone handheld starlink option will help with that with basic two way comms (texting), but I assume you will need someone to message you the forecast as opposed to downloading it direct from the web. Obviously the ability to two way text in darkest Fiordland will assist greatly with safety as well. Provided you can charge you phone somehow. Na I’m not referencing starlink . Just asking how the speed of the OneNz via phones will compare to data coming down the 4G pipe . We won’t bother subscribing if it’s not as fast as 4G as we don’t “need” 24/7 internet on the boat .
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Post by Punter on Aug 1, 2024 9:20:48 GMT 12
What OneNZ will offer is not already available. You're conflating two completely different technologies. OneNZ will be offering SpaceX to Mobile Phones. It will initially be TXT only, then they will add voice and eventually they will add data. According to the Rocket Scientists the data speed will never be able exceed around 15Mbit/s this is apparently due to the physical limitations at a wave length level of how much space a receiver needs to take up to. It's a universe limitation like the speed of light. Right now you can buy Starlink. Which uses big antennas the same SpaceX constellation but different frewuencies. The antennas are much bigger than your phone and can comfortably reach 100Mbits/s and faster. Whoever said wait for OneNZ to get mobile on your phone either is a idiot or didn't have all the information. If they meant wait for Chorus to deliver fibre and then get a service via OneNZ over the fibre then that's a very different proposition and is a order of magnitude better than Starlink. If the meant wait for OneNZ to plop in another cell tower then that is also a very different proposition and a few less orders better than fibre but still better than Starlink. If you have a modern mobile phone with VoWiFi it will work over any of the above services when you don't have 3G/4G. I was taking and making regular txt and voice calls in the middle of the south Pacific over starlink with zero issues just last week. And of course I also had full Internet access. Tldr; Get starlink. If local services become available in the future you can always switch and sell the starlink I can discuss with you next time I come to buy a rope. So you reckon 4G is quicker than what OneNz will offer via spaceX ? I have my phone on rocket mobile/one republic with unlimited data and it was excellent for cruising last summer . We could hotspot and watch Netflix , YouTube etc no problem on iPad and MacBook even with only two bars of signal at times . We see internet on the boat as a nice to have not a need so if OneNz is average probably won’t bother with it . On the other hand it would add one more level of safety being able to text or call from somewhere remote like Fiordland etc . Do you think it would improve the Predictwind race tracker ?! We start to split hairs now... OneNZ "SpaceX to mobile device for Data" will be significantly slower than "cell tower to mobile device for data". They will both use 4G/5G - understand that 4G/5G is a communications protocol and not a guarantee of speed. While it's technically possible to reach 20Gbit/s on 5G there's a gazillion factors in the real world that stop that from being achieved. SpaceX to mobile for mobile calling and text will be indistinguishable from what you have today. SpaceX to mobile for data will be an order of magnitude slower than cell tower to mobile. If your out of cell tower coverage and you want to send the odd email, download a few GRIB files from predictwind or check in on family via WhatsApp then SpaceX Data will be just fine. Starlink is a separate beast, it does not use 4G/5G it has large (compared to a mobile device) phase array antennas that track the satellites. These are mounted on the boat and it's damn fast anywhere on the planet. Nb: OneNZ SpaceX for data and calling is still a long way away. Musk needs to launch a metric fuck ton of new generation satellites. OneNZ SpaceX for TXT is on target for Dec/2024
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Post by em on Aug 1, 2024 9:27:48 GMT 12
So you reckon 4G is quicker than what OneNz will offer via spaceX ? I have my phone on rocket mobile/one republic with unlimited data and it was excellent for cruising last summer . We could hotspot and watch Netflix , YouTube etc no problem on iPad and MacBook even with only two bars of signal at times . We see internet on the boat as a nice to have not a need so if OneNz is average probably won’t bother with it . On the other hand it would add one more level of safety being able to text or call from somewhere remote like Fiordland etc . Do you think it would improve the Predictwind race tracker ?! We start to split hairs now... OneNZ "SpaceX to mobile device for Data" will be significantly slower than "cell tower to mobile device for data". They will both use 4G/5G - understand that 4G/5G is a communications protocol and not a guarantee of speed. While it's technically possible to reach 20Gbit/s on 5G there's a gazillion factors in the real world that stop that from being achieved. SpaceX to mobile for mobile calling and text will be indistinguishable from what you have today. SpaceX to mobile for data will be an order of magnitude slower than cell tower to mobile. If your out of cell tower coverage and you want to send the odd email, download a few GRIB files from predictwind or check in on family via WhatsApp then SpaceX Data will be just fine. Starlink is a separate beast, it does not use 4G/5G it has large (compared to a mobile device) phase array antennas that track the satellites. These are mounted on the boat and it's damn fast anywhere on the planet. Nb: OneNZ SpaceX for data and calling is still a long way away. Musk needs to launch a metric fuck ton of new generation satellites. OneNZ SpaceX for TXT is on target for Dec/2024 Thanks for that info , spot on .
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Post by GO30 on Aug 1, 2024 13:16:06 GMT 12
What OneNZ will offer is not already available. You're conflating two completely different technologies. Yeap aware there is some conflating going on above. But reading on I didn't realise there is Starlink and then there is SpaceX, each are different. Never knew that but now I do a couple of things said now make more sense.
So just to clarify a clustered head this morning, it's been one of those, we'll have these options which while being similar are different.
1 - Someone can get Starlink which means a Dishy and you get very good speed data for interweb and so on. With that one could also use interweb phone apps like Whatsapp, to communicate by voice.
2 - Someone could also get a OneNZ SpaceX phone, when they get here, and use that anywhere for voice communication but for data it will be slow and probably quite frustrating.
3 - Someone wanting OK speed data, in most of NZ that has no fibre or other options, would be better off to get a decent phone and just hotspot (which is our current setup)
So it's a case of picking what works best for the end game you are chasing?
For us wanting monitoring i.e. real time video, having no fibre option we have Hotspot or Starlink, stay away from the OneNZ offering. As a fixed longer term solution I'm thinking Starlink is smarter than hotspot.
Am I on track with all that?
5G is very short range that's why we'll see bugger all of it outside of the CBD and Ponsonby Road, or so I am told. Oh, and Takapuna/Devonport, this I know as they changed the antenna at Hauraki Corner a wee while ago,I can hear it as I ride past. Hear it? What hole have you gone down? I have bluetooth comms in my helmets. One day I rode past H Cnr to see them changing antenna, a few days later as I got about 120m from the new array my comms went evil, about 100m past it stopped, been that way ever since. On sussing the changes they made were swapping from 4G to 5G. No idea if I need to swap to a tin foil helmet but the coincidence is a little spooky.
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