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Post by Hugh Jorgan on Nov 18, 2023 9:06:32 GMT 12
Peeps, i have a NZ yachtmaster Qualification done in 2001 via NZ Coastgaurd. I just got a new plastic ( photo ID) warrant card from NZC and was going to get a ICC fir sailing in europe when i realisd that the Ycchtmaster qual via NZC is not a RYA one? Or is it?
Before i approach the NZC? Are they transferable or do i have to get a seperate RYA yachtmasters cert.?
Thanks
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Post by fish on Nov 18, 2023 11:28:21 GMT 12
Peeps, i have a NZ yachtmaster Qualification done in 2001 via NZ Coastgaurd. I just got a new plastic ( photo ID) warrant card from NZC and was going to get a ICC fir sailing in europe when i realisd that the Ycchtmaster qual via NZC is not a RYA one? Or is it? Before i approach the NZC? Are they transferable or do i have to get a seperate RYA yachtmasters cert.? Thanks Anything from NZ CG doesn't even touch the sides of a RYA qualification, specifically RYA Yachtmaster. NZ CG only do a Boatmaster, (especially from 2001), which is just a few nightclasses. More of an introductory warm up on how to read a chart. I have RYA Yachtmaster (Full) and RYA Yachtmaster Ocean (theory) (and NZ CG Boatmaster incidentally). Boatmaster is possibly equivalent to RYA Competent Crew, or maybe Day Skipper. RYA Yachtmaster requires logged sea miles (I can't remember how many, but a fair few, including overnight and multi-day voyages) a week of on-water training and an on water examination, all after getting the theory qualification. If I remember correctly you also need RYA Radio Operator and RYA Sea Survival as pre-requisites to get the full Yachtmaster qualification. But the extension of all that, an RYA Yachtmaster is well OTT for getting an ICC for Europe sailing. Are you wanting to Charter in Europe? Is that why you need the paperwork? My understanding with ICC is you just need to show you can get a charter boat out of and back into its berth, but because I had all the RYA quals I never went through that process.
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Post by Fogg on Nov 18, 2023 11:30:33 GMT 12
I thought all NZC’s advanced sailing courses are effectively RYA courses. And that NZ-era are now eligible to apply for European ICCs. So it sounds like you should have everything you need for a direct issue.
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Post by Fogg on Nov 18, 2023 11:37:18 GMT 12
From CG NZ website:
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Post by fish on Nov 18, 2023 12:25:38 GMT 12
I thought all NZC’s advanced sailing courses are effectively RYA courses. And that NZ-era are now eligible to apply for European ICCs. So it sounds like you should have everything you need for a direct issue. The only caveat with that is that Hugh did his NZ C qualification way back in 2001. Coast Guard have likely lifted their game since then. I wouldn't be surprised if Hugh will need to re-do a qualification to make sure it's relevant. Possibly easiest just to do the CG's ICC course. I would say the first step is to confirm with CG Boating Education for cross over from 2001.
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Post by Fogg on Nov 18, 2023 13:09:25 GMT 12
Agree that if RYA ICC is what you’re after then doing a fresh ICC quickly here with CGNZ is probably safest option.
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Post by fish on Nov 18, 2023 13:23:30 GMT 12
Just had a quick look at Coastguard Boating Education to remind myself. The ICC requires a practical component. The Boatmaster does not, therefore I doubt CG Boatmaster is any good for accreditation to ICC. Note that I am assuming when Hugh said he did 'Yachtmaster' with CG in 2001, he is referring to the Boatmaster certificate, 30hrs of classroom time plus a written and oral assessment. I did mine at about the same time (early 2000's). It was about the only CG qualification available back in the day. Having a quick look at available courses for ICC in Auckland, they are all on water sailing school providers, reinforcing the practical component. As I said previously, I believe the ICC's main purpose is to make sure you can get a charter boat out of and back into a berth. I have heard previously that all people had to do was show they could launch a run-about off a trailer, do a lap of the marina and get it back onto the trailer at the boat ramp. ICC (International Certificate of Competance) - What is it? The ICC is a certificate, issued according to Resolution 40 of the United Nations Economic Commission for Europe (UNECE) Inland Transport committee, and intended to provide evidence of competence to operate a particular vessel when requested by officials in foreign countries. It is an assurance from one government to another that the certificate holder is sufficiently competent to be driving a pleasure craft, despite not holding the visited country’s national certificate. The ICC should be automatically accepted in countries which have adopted Resolution 40, however not all of the UNECE countries have fully adopted it. The onus is on ICC holders to determine its acceptability by foreign states, as the ICC was never intended to be an alternative to individual national qualification requirements. Who is eligible for an ICC? The ICC is now available to New Zealand citizens. Nationals of many other countries are also eligible, including Australia, South Africa, UK and USA. Citizens of other European countries will usually need to apply through their own national authority. How do I get an ICC and how much does it cost? ICCs are issued following a short practical and knowledge assessment at an RYA training Centre or by supplying another certificate as evidence of competence. RYA Training Centres will charge for their time and use of a training vessel (if required) to conduct the assessment, and any training you may require beforehand. ICCs incur a admin/processing/certificate fee of $95.00 - payable to CBE. Holders of certificates accepted as evidence of competence can apply direct to CBE. All applicant requiring an assessment should apply through an RYA Training Centre. www.boatingeducation.org.nz/courses/
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Post by Hugh Jorgan on Nov 18, 2023 13:38:29 GMT 12
Sorry, not 2001, 2009 Yacht Master.
All I'm after is A ICC for Europe sailing
Its required for sailing your own boat as well as charter.
I understand that having a RYA cert will suffice?
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Post by fish on Nov 18, 2023 14:23:54 GMT 12
Sorry, not 2001, 2009 Yacht Master. All I'm after is A ICC for Europe sailing Its required for sailing your own boat as well as charter. I understand that having a RYA cert will suffice? I'm not following your question now. Do you have an RYA Yachtmaster that you got via Coastguard Boating Education? If this is the case, it easily covers ICC. RYA dictate the syllabus, there are loads of certified training organisations globally, normally sailing schools, but Coastguard Boating Education is one. So even if you did the qual via NZ Coastguard, it is still an RYA qualification. Noting there is a big difference between CG Boatmaster and RYA Yachtmaster (hence my earlier comments)
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Post by sloopjohnb on Nov 18, 2023 16:28:10 GMT 12
Does my 1976 yatchmaster's count for anything???
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Post by fish on Nov 18, 2023 16:55:08 GMT 12
Does my 1976 yatchmaster's count for anything??? Probably not. I mean, you'd have to do an update module on how to navigate without charts, a compass or a sextant. Was that before auxiliary engines were invented? You might need to do a module on diesel engine maintenance and operation And a module on what modern yacht materials are, assuming 1976 was carvel planked wood and hemp rope, you'd need to get up to speed on how to splice a UhMPE-LGBQ+ brace Oh, and you'd definitely have to do a module on diversity and inclusion, and crew mental well-being. You just can't chuck a drunken sailor in a longboat till he's sober anymore...
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Post by Hugh Jorgan on Nov 18, 2023 19:40:27 GMT 12
Sorry, not 2001, 2009 Yacht Master. All I'm after is A ICC for Europe sailing Its required for sailing your own boat as well as charter. I understand that having a RYA cert will suffice? I'm not following your question now. Do you have an RYA Yachtmaster that you got via Coastguard Boating Education? If this is the case, it easily covers ICC. RYA dictate the syllabus, there are loads of certified training organisations globally, normally sailing schools, but Coastguard Boating Education is one. So even if you did the qual via NZ Coastguard, it is still an RYA qualification. Noting there is a big difference between CG Boatmaster and RYA Yachtmaster (hence my earlier comments) sorry .. I have a CG yachtmaster with no RYA noted on it. Can I ask the CG for an RYA endorsement?.. and thus get ICC?
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Post by fish on Nov 19, 2023 9:31:34 GMT 12
I'm not following your question now. Do you have an RYA Yachtmaster that you got via Coastguard Boating Education? If this is the case, it easily covers ICC. RYA dictate the syllabus, there are loads of certified training organisations globally, normally sailing schools, but Coastguard Boating Education is one. So even if you did the qual via NZ Coastguard, it is still an RYA qualification. Noting there is a big difference between CG Boatmaster and RYA Yachtmaster (hence my earlier comments) sorry .. I have a CG yachtmaster with no RYA noted on it. Can I ask the CG for an RYA endorsement?.. and thus get ICC? I have never heard of a CG Yachtmaster. It is not listed under the CG Boating Education qualifications. There is Boatmaster, which is a theory course and wont accredit to ICC. There is the RYA Yachtmaster that definitely covers ICC. Short story, if there was a practical component to your yachtmaster I'd say it will accredit to ICC. So if you did an on water assessment or on water training with an instructor I think you'd be fine. If it was only theory it wont.
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Post by chariot on Nov 19, 2023 10:30:41 GMT 12
Did coastal yachtmaster years ago at Manukau Tech. Jim Lott was the Tutor. Had to go into the city to sit 2 three hour papers at the completion of the course. One was compass and metrology and the other was all chartwork. The class chartered the Spirit of NZ and went up to Mokes on Friday night, then Barrier on Saturday and back home Sunday. Bloody good weekend.
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Post by Hugh Jorgan on Nov 19, 2023 13:49:03 GMT 12
Just soent the last hour digging through the archives in the garage.
And boom 💥. Ive go it all wrong ( piss poor memory)
The forms say 2009 Coastal skipper.
They don't do this course anymore but it did involve overnite sailing in the practical assessment... That I do remember that 🙄.
I believe It is now called the yacht master coastal RYA..
But I am not sure if the one I did is ICC ok'd?
I will ring the NZCG Monday
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