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Post by ComfortZone on Sept 13, 2023 13:37:14 GMT 12
I like my overnighting so one option should I part ways with CZ is a mega trailer boat, I like the look of Dan Leech's cats eg leechboats.com/power/l875-semi-displacement-power-catView AttachmentOne of these launches at Sandspit. There are some related costs on top of the boat, $30k+ for the trailer (fully braked + breakaway system) and a decent tow vehicle. The Sandspit guy tows his with a 100 series cruiser, say with half full tanks and an alloy trailer he just squeaks under 3500kg. You would need at least a Cruiser or Y62 Patrol (thirsty!!), better a RAM or Silverado or even a 4.5t truck to tow. No way would you put one of these behind a dual cab ute for any distance, it would be classic tail wagging dog. But once set up you could travel further afield for a summer to the North Is or Sth Is lakes, Marlborough sounds etc. I'm always fascinated by the cost of petrol in those things. The boat review articles always seem very quiet on it, unless it is a tinny tinny or a new design cat. Makes the fish very expensive if you boost around the Gulf chasing workups. It would be fascinating to know the annual cost of fuelling one of those things compared with the days of use and comparative cost to marina and yacht maintenance. Oh, and being able to get to a boat ramp on those cracking days when the rest of Auckland is doing the same. I saw something like 50 boats queing to get in at the Gulf Harbour ramp once. While the costs of my pile mooring have been going up alot, I'm going to hang onto it like shit sticking to a blanket. An affordable spot to park your boat is like rocking horse shit these days. These snips are from the report on an early Roger Hill disp 10m power cat, Outpost with twin 60 Yammies, still moored at OBC   you can see at 4500 revs she is running at 13.7kts consuming 8.8lph/ 0.64 l per NM which in my book is economical running. I would expect similar or better numbers from the Leech cats being a bit smaller and lighter. By comparison my old Vindex 32 with a 185 Perkins used to burn about 30lph at 15.5kts Re annual use, the sales manager from Haines Hunter once told me they commissioned a survey and it came up with the average fizz boat clocking 38hrs per yr, which I think might be generous. Rule of thumb for moored launches has always been 100 hrs per year. Don't even think about what the all up cost (capex + opex) per hour equates to! On the launching issue, Sandspit has the option of launching the night before and leaving the boat on the visitors jetty (for a small fee) for an early departure to beat the ramp chaos. If it is a sunny Friday there always seem to be a lot of tradies utes in the carpark with empty trailers  |
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Post by harrytom on Sept 13, 2023 16:01:03 GMT 12
Have slightly changed habits from 4.30am launches and 1.00pm retrevals to avoid ramp chaos too. 2.00pm launches and 7/8.00pm retrevals.When daylight saving kicks in and cooler in the evening or sick day Wednesday. Ramp fee $120 per yr with members carpark
My fuelusage depends on if its a off the ramp fish or have to travel a bit. economic for 90hp merc/yammy/suzi etc is 3800rpm equates 1.3lt per mile or push it WOT 1.8lt per mile at $3.00 lt 95oct. Its hobby now whats a golf club fee + green fees cost?
Bait costs should be nil this yr,softbaits costs roughly $13 for 5 and slider $7 for 1 not an expensive day out. Difference between cruising a yacht is probably my beer/rum/gin bill. wash down at home and 2 beers and thats it.leave fish on ice overnight to harden up a bit and 2 beers while cleaning next day.
But its not cost to me its a time poor life style.Run the student back Sunday afternoons or visit boy in TGA then rush home to get student back.Got to get those nana naps in.
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Post by chariot on Sept 13, 2023 16:37:56 GMT 12
I pay an annual fee to launch from the marina. They restrict the numbers to 250. You would never get any numbers close to that at one time, plus only 3 boats at a time within the marina complex. $115 per year just to use the public ramps, so would rather pay extra at the marina with no tidal influence.
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Post by fish on Sept 13, 2023 19:53:48 GMT 12
What do those stack pack arrangements cost? The ones where they launch your boat for your with a fork lift, fuel it etc, give it a washdown on the way back and what not.
Has to be some merit in those, provided the stackpack guys can manage the demand on busy mornings. Assume if you want to do a roadie with your boat you have to get the forklift to put it in the water, then load it onto your trailer and head off. Mind you, I imagine half the advantage is not needing a trailer or tow vehicle. As in not needing space to store an empty trailer at home etc.
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Post by ComfortZone on Sept 13, 2023 21:45:32 GMT 12
What do those stack pack arrangements cost? The ones where they launch your boat for your with a fork lift, fuel it etc, give it a washdown on the way back and what not. Has to be some merit in those, provided the stackpack guys can manage the demand on busy mornings. Assume if you want to do a roadie with your boat you have to get the forklift to put it in the water, then load it onto your trailer and head off. Mind you, I imagine half the advantage is not needing a trailer or tow vehicle. As in not needing space to store an empty trailer at home etc. These are Pier 21 rates pier21.co.nz/services/drystackboatpark/I believe Orams are more expensive, however they can take boats up to about 12m (https://oramsmarine.co.nz/new-zealand/boat-park/) . Not a cheap solution but certainly benefits in having the boat undercover, not needing antifouling etc. They put boats on cradles on the floor for servicing access. Assume you would need to launch it to put on a conventional trailer but most would not have a trailer anyway. The forklift can probably drop it straight onto specialist boat movers trailers. |
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Post by chariot on Sept 14, 2023 9:31:44 GMT 12
I sold my 10.5m marina berth at Pine Harbour to a guy who had a big fizzy. Had it on the dry stack but got pissed off with the damage that was being done by the yard staff when launching and retrieving to restack. Every time there was more scrapes and gouges.
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Post by dutyfree on Sept 14, 2023 18:29:51 GMT 12
When we can’t afford the combination of launch and Westhaven we will go to a tinny or similar. Still have a few years on the westhaven lease (2029) but then we will be out of that boating market. Have you had any thoughts about one of the shared ownership schemes? I know they have their pluses and minuses ie not YOUR boat and cannot use it at the drop of a hat, but work for some not really attracted to it. 20 plus years across 4 boats of our own. We often just go and sit on them in the marina in the weekend for a change of scenery |
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Post by Fogg on Sept 14, 2023 18:35:52 GMT 12
Have you had any thoughts about one of the shared ownership schemes? I know they have their pluses and minuses ie not YOUR boat and cannot use it at the drop of a hat, but work for some not really attracted to it. 20 plus years across 4 boats of our own. We often just go and sit on them in the marina in the weekend for a change of scenery Same. |
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Post by ComfortZone on Sept 15, 2023 12:44:25 GMT 12
You do have to wonder where the NZ boating scene is headed considering at a guess around 80% of the fleet of moored boats is over 30yrs old, including CZ. What is going to happen to the likes of the launches Chariot knocked back and many other yachts/launches of similar age/condition that need an investment that will over capitalise them to bring them back to good condition. Even having spent the money there are the mooring and insurance issues to consider as well. No doubt at Westhaven as the 2026 and 2029 licences expire there will be a lot of reconfiguring of berths to accommodate more and more large Rivitimo's and the like.
I am even pondering if it is time to move CZ on (after over 23 yrs ownership!) but not sure to what. If I am not going offshore again then probably a launch but not alot that appeals (and doesn't need money thrown at it) in my price bracket. I do have the offer to use a mate's rather large keel boat (he lives out of town most of the year) which would be a convenient fill in and then a left field option would be to offer my marina berth rent free in exchange for use of the boat parked there.
All things to ponder on over the Christmas cruise.
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Post by chariot on Sept 15, 2023 13:56:53 GMT 12
You have hit the nail on the head CZ. We sure do have an aging fleet and less people getting involved in cruising. Over capitalising was my main concern, plus the fact that I'm over all the annual maintenance. Turned 70 last week, so can't be bothered with all that.
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Post by Fogg on Sept 15, 2023 14:46:41 GMT 12
If you look on TM under Keelers / latest listings you see a steady procession of decades-old kiwi boats desperately being offloaded. Some of them have been listed on & off for literally years.
I suspect that if somebody offered an amnesty service to collect all the unwanted old boats, you could fill every pothole in NZ and cleanup the harbours all at the same time.
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Post by fish on Sept 15, 2023 15:19:41 GMT 12
40 yrs old appears to be a magic age for insurers to say 'catch-ya later, sucker'... too.
Increasingly hearing stories of people who can't get insurance, or are refused insurance for 40 yr old boats. Often they are on swing moorings as well, which is a major contributing factor.
To be honest, from the insurance point of view, if its on a swing mooring it is hard to maintain properly. As in, just getting out to it do do little jobs is hard. Add in the age, and you have a major risk. We all think the liability is low because of the low resale value, but the liability is generally a minimum of $5million. That is third party, but the main factor is salvage and disposal, that is where the cost and liability lie.
What to do?
It would be good to have a boat scrapping service, like you do when your car shits itself. Phone a guy, he comes and takes it off your hands. Would cost moonbeams with old boats though.
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Post by ComfortZone on Sept 15, 2023 16:54:43 GMT 12
If you look on TM under Keelers / latest listings you see a steady procession of decades-old kiwi boats desperately being offloaded. Some of them have been listed on & off for literally years. I suspect that if somebody offered an amnesty service to collect all the unwanted old boats, you could fill every pothole in NZ and cleanup the harbours all at the same time. Not just in NZ, we are behind countries such as UK, France, USA, Canada and Australia where they were pumping out production boats in large numbers some time before NZ. The general problem is that Fibreglass does not break down and add to that in NZ our wood boats were generally well built from durable materials. There are a couple of boat dismantling operations in UK and Europe but early days. The problem is the fibreglass, about all that can be done economically is grind it up and burn it. |
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Post by harrytom on Sept 15, 2023 17:36:03 GMT 12
Old glass yachts turn in to tiny homes?? From what I have heard.When the harbour master removes a vessel its taken straight to landfill,too expensive to strip and no big market for old parts. Even when mine went up for sale on T/M by the insurance company,did ask what happens if not sold and they confirmed it ,to the tip so remove what you want before we list it.
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Post by ComfortZone on Sept 15, 2023 18:41:33 GMT 12
no big market for old parts. that's for sure, I have a heap of old gear, fittings etc and every now and again list some on TM but few takers. We had a carpark sale at SYC a while ago, I took a heap of gear as did others, about all I sold was a few blocks. The main reason there is no market is hardly anyone is building their own boats these days. |
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